Dota 2

[Icecrypt]

Like the title sais, i cant be the only person who thinks the game will utterly fail if the option to concede isnt put in and especially if no ratings are implemented.

80 % of the matches i loose i loose because i'm teamed with people who doesnt understand the game or their heroes and the other team has people that do. Its just not playable when you get teamed with (lets face it) noobs over and over again and especially when you cant concede either so you have no option but to wait the game out. You can try to do some sort of comeback but it never happens.

For me im playing less and less dota 2 atm because the game isnt fun when your constantly getting teamed with frankly idiots and the other team have friends on vent and stuff that just dominates your team. And yes i could make "friends" and do the same thing and win 24/7 but is that how the game is supposed to be ?

Anywho. What do you guys think.

Yes i know the game is in beta...

[Aconit]

You already said everything. Game is in Beta and you can also have teamates. In a second hand I believe that there is some kind of rating. I personnally don't play with "uber noob". My mates are sometimes good, sometimes bad, but they are rarely terrible players.

If you're trully looking for help here, then go in IHL post and sign up

[Snuffeldjuret]

There indeed is a rating system, it's just that you don't see what people have. You can get some indication by searching for low/mid/high skill matches and people.

I hope and expect Dota 2 to include visible rating and a good concede/forfeit option.

[Aconit]

I hope and expect Dota 2 to include visible rating

Personnally I hope not. People flame to much when rating is visible. I played HoN and it totally split the community.

I'm also convince that player lvl is highly dependant on hero. I personnally suck with nevermore and when I try to play this hero in order to progress it's always feedfest for ennemy team because I'm mostly matched with good players.

Dota 1 was fun because people play for fun, not in order to increase rating...

[Captain Planet]

There is already an internal rating system. That's what the match making system uses. Frankly I don't give a flying fuck what my rating is so I don't see the need for it to become visible to anyone (including myself). As for the getting constantly pwned; that comes down to what experience level you choose when you first started Dota 2 (novice, moderate or expert) and how well you play.

Let me say this though, I can't remember the last time I DIDN'T play a Dota 2 match with friends; it's much more fun and I almost always have friends online to play with. It's not inconvenient in the least for me. Dota 2 is a team game...so it makes sense to play with a team doesn't it?

[Snuffeldjuret]

I never had any problems with visible rating in HoN. Well, some noobs were quite upset that they didn't always have highest rating ^^. Generally I feel that it easier to get people to listen to you if you have higher rating, and it is easier to listen to people who themselves have higher. Many times in HoN there were quite a lot of difference.

Obviously you are better with some heroes and worse with others.

I think Dota 2 is more enjoyable when people play to win, not when they play to have fun. People usually spoil the fun for others when they are trying to have "fun" themselves if that is not fun as in winning.

Even when playing with friends, I have noticed that the visible rating is very good when teaching them about stuff. Most or all people over-estimate their own skill, and a visible rating system makes some people see the truth.

As a classic inhouse community admin, I would really love to see a public rating, would make it a lot easier to reach out to my target audience and get the lesser skilled players to listen to the more experienced ones.

[Aconit]

I think Dota 2 is more enjoyable when people play to win, not when they play to have fun. People usually spoil the fun for others when they are trying to have "fun" themselves if that is not fun as in winning.

You're obviously not a Techies player

Most or all people over-estimate their own skill, and a visible rating system makes some people see the truth.

If you played HoN, I'm pretty sure you remember the famous "my MMR is low because I'm always matched with noobs".

[Snuffeldjuret]

True, I don't enjoy techies ^^.

Well many people may say that, but I am quite sure most of them saying it does not believe it themselves. People act a lot more stupid than they are.

[Captain Planet]

As for the concede option: I sincerely hope one is never implemented. I have been in games where either my team or the other team have come back and won well after any probable concede point would've been had. There are also way too many factors involved to have a completely perfect concede option (if it's not 100% perfect, I don't want it). The biggest factor is the fact that what could happen 30 seconds ahead is unknown, much less 5 or 10 min ahead. This coupled with the fact that late game teams could be able to withstand an earlygame onslaught and come back to win after 45-50min. Giving a concede option basically gives an all too easy out option.

What's more, even if it requires a unanimous vote, there could be in-game recriminations or even reportings of player who don't vote for the concede, which would be a terrible thing because that player might actually believe the game to still be winnable at that point. So I think a concede option would be bad. Unless the concede function could somehow detect impenetrable fountain camping, I don't want one.

[Aconit]

True, I don't enjoy techies ^^.

Well many people may say that, but I am quite sure most of them saying it does not believe it themselves. People act a lot more stupid than they are.

I disagree. Many people just don't wanna see their real skill. It's so true that players in HoN try to create TSR (True Rating Skill) because they were like "omg, I don't have enough MMR so it should be a wrong way to judge people skill".

But the most important point is why you don't enjoy Techies. My best SD ever would have been squee, spleen and spoon.


Regarding concede option, I agree with what Captain planet said. Ok some games are a bit too long but it still better than "go go concede" spam during 10 minutes after firstblood.

[Draphcone]

i feel you bro. play with real life friends, it improves the situation a lot.

[ehergeiz323]

i never liked the idea of a way to concede in dota 2, takes away the fun and what makes dota better from other games.

play and try to win matches, hopefully you'll rank up and you'll get less and less newbies.
i barely get them as team mates nor opponents anymore.

[Snuffeldjuret]

Not sure what to say Aconit. I have had very little problem with the fact that rating was visible in HoN. It is the visible stats that was the problem.

I just think that Dota 2 is now worse than HoN was. AFK in fountain and feeding vs concede spam. Valve can make a better system than the concede spam system.

[Draphcone]

Why not play co-op bot in the meantime? That update was the reason why I didn't leave my dota 2 to rot on steam.

The bots are very "realistic" and the unfair (hardest) bots are really challenging, i only play 2nd hardest right now, though their heroes and playing style are always ganking, like they frequently have tidehunter, zeus and razor.

Matchmaking is also very fast, most likely because it only requires 5 players to start a game. It doesn't affect your wins and loses and it's always safe to leave, so if you NEED to stop the game you won't feel so obliged to continue playing. I also don't really care if my team mates leave anyway. It's quite a good way to get used to dota 2 itself and playing with other players in dota 2.

Maybe you guys prefer playing against actual people and increase your performance and wins etc. though if I'm playing alone (not with my friend(s)) I prefer "playing safe".

[Snuffeldjuret]

To be honest I think that having visible rating would be better than what we have today, with win% visible through stats.dota2.be
Rating is interpreted way better than win%.

[Captain Planet]

One final thought on the issue of concede. A few weeks ago I played a very bad game. We got stomped pretty hard (but surprisingly there were no hard feelings, the other team just played much better than us) and everyone on my team left. I stayed for the lolz and defended successfully for about 5min before being overpowered by weight of numbers. All the while there was hilarity in all-chat.

At the end of the match the other team commended me for staying through to the end and not leaving as well. I think people need to remember that it's just a game and even if you get stomped...it's still JUST A GAME. So even if a concede option is added, I won't ever use it because I think it's bad gamesmanship to just end the game by default. And while I hate fountain camping as much as the next person, I think that the best solution is to add a report option to report playing for fountain camping.

[Snuffeldjuret]

I had some crazy thought that maybe Valve will keep cc/ff out of the game to help out communities, because in in-house games cc/ff is as real as ever. In my community we cc/ff a lot, and we're loving it! It makes it just a little easier to attract people to join us, which is good =).